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Chiibi
Joined: 19 Dec 2011
Posts: 4829
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 Posted: Fri Jun 23, 2023 7:57 pm
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| TheFanCon wrote: | | And maybe also Sailor Moon, Saint Seiya (if what they were doing to it ever got off the ground), and arguably DB (because an amateur studio got the license via nepotism and it's led to lots of division).
Oh, Escaflowne and Initial D too even though they didn't last long. |
No, as BAD as all those were, they didn't try to make someone who wasn't the lead character into a lead character.
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TheFanCon
Joined: 14 Jun 2023
Posts: 48
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Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2023 4:17 pm
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True (although I heard that this was also the case with Escaflowne at least).
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mgree0032
Joined: 27 Jun 2022
Posts: 260
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Posted: Sun Jun 25, 2023 7:17 am
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| Chiibi wrote: | | No, as BAD as all those were, they didn't try to make someone who wasn't the lead character into a lead character. |
the fact that Fox Kids cut the show into something else and replaced Yoko Konno’s music is very insultingly corporate at worst.
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TheFanCon
Joined: 14 Jun 2023
Posts: 48
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Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2023 1:03 pm
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It's one thing I wonder, people excuse replacement scores when certain series are involved (DBZ), but those same people would likely decry the same happening to high profile names like hers (or to some other previously discussed series).
Stuff like this is why I utterly condemn the practice without exception. It's the same bottom line with all of them, for better or worse.
And only ridiculous U.S. corporations (by extension Canadian ones too) have a track record of this, even today, if they had their way they'd be utilizing their own replacement scores (which they do only for those toy commercial anime series they have actual involvement in and make a bunch of edits to anyway).
But it's not like TV is that significant a medium anymore anyway, and most anime isn't getting aired on cable channels.
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mgree0032
Joined: 27 Jun 2022
Posts: 260
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Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2023 11:57 am
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| TheFanCon wrote: | | And only ridiculous U.S. corporations (by extension Canadian ones too) have a track record of this, even today, if they had their way they'd be utilizing their own replacement scores (which they do only for those toy commercial anime series they have actual involvement in and make a bunch of edits to anyway).
But it's not like TV is that significant a medium anymore anyway, and most anime isn't getting aired on cable channels. |
I do believe that anime could be on TV again if showrunners just put in age ratings for the shows that they were going to aired back then.
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TheFanCon
Joined: 14 Jun 2023
Posts: 48
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Posted: Fri Jun 30, 2023 10:49 am
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| getchman wrote: | | a better, updated dub and apparently adding back a few scenes that were previously edited out |
So that means even the uncut dub with Ocean actors wasn't good enough?
Or was there even such a thing in the first place?
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Snomaster1
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Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 2814
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Posted: Mon Jul 03, 2023 4:46 pm
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I'll say this. I never really had a problem with "Cardcaptors." It came across as a fun,decent show. It may have been an edited version of the show,but I didn't really have a problem with it. I liked it well enough. Others may not have liked it but I did.
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Cardcaptor Takato
Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 4881
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Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2023 7:16 pm
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Cardcaptors is a dub I have a lot of mixed feelings about. I don't like the removing of the queer themes and Japanese culture and the weird episode order Kids WB did. But it was my first introduction to CCS which is one of my favorite magical girl shows and my introduction to CLAMP. I think the voice performances are still pretty good and there's some notable performances from actors who were also in major American cartoons like Kero, Tori and Julian's VAs were in Ed, Edd, n Eddy and some VAs were also in X-men Evolution. I also appreciated they had real kids playing Sakura and Li and thought Carly McKillip and Rhys Huber did a fine job with their characters.
The dub music was also a bop and I still appreciate that we got to see Madhouse's gorgeous animation on Saturday morning TV which always put it a cut above everything else that was on Saturday mornings then. I have since seen all the dub episodes that didn't air in the US and it should be noted the episodes that weren't on Kids WB were dubbed much more accuate than the Kid's WB episodes and it becomes obvious the worst problems came from Kids WB. Granted they still had annoying censorship but at least with the Teletoon episodes they kept Sakura as the main character and the general plot was still the same. I think it should be considered Cardcaptors was from a different era when anime was just entering the mainstream and society was even less accepting of queer people back then so they did their best to make it a marketable kids show under Kids WB bizarre corporate meddling because they tried to compete with Pokemon at the time.
I guess at this point in 2023 when localized anime dubbing isn't much of a thing anymore and you can easily watch all of CCS uncut now I don't see the point of still being mad about Cardcaptors or going into some anti dub tirade about it when I can just see it as a fascinating relic of the past that had some interesting voice acting talent in it and I just view Cardcaptors as it's own separate show. But I always wonder why anime fans are still unforgiving towards Cardcaptors but a lot of those same fans still love the 90s dub of Sailor Moon and DBZ and I even see a lot of fans argue those dubs are even better than the original which I disagree with but Cardcaptors is too much of an unholy blasphemy. It's definitely not something I would want to see done with modern dubs but I would say Cardcaptors was just as important as the DiC Sailor Moon in making magical girl anime more mainstream and it introduced a lot of millennial fans to CLAMP and their larger library of works. Also noteworthy in Australia they dubbed the Japanese theme songs for Cardcaptors.
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mgree0032
Joined: 27 Jun 2022
Posts: 260
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Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2023 4:17 am
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Just like people still love the 4kids dubs of Pokémon and Yugioh so much. It because in case with Sailor moon and Dragon Ball Z, those dubs were done in the early to mid-90s. Cardcaptors was dubbed in the year 2000.
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Alan45
Village Elder
Joined: 25 Aug 2010
Posts: 9861
Location: Virginia
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Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2023 7:12 am
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| mgree0032 wrote: | | Cardcaptors was dubbed in the year 2000. |
And that was 23 years ago. In anime terms that is ancient history. It was butchered to put on cable TV. That was a marginal source for anime at the time and is even less relevant now. Even then an uncut sub version was put out on home video (DVD) which was the primary source for anime at the time.
As history it should be remembered, but given the lack of any relevance to what is being done today I don't see why it warrants any strong emotions. Think of it as growing pains in the efforts to bring anime to the English speaking audience.
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Cardcaptor Takato
Joined: 27 Jan 2018
Posts: 4881
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Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2023 10:49 pm
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| mgree0032 wrote: | | Just like people still love the 4kids dubs of Pokémon and Yugioh so much. It because in case with Sailor moon and Dragon Ball Z, those dubs were done in the early to mid-90s. Cardcaptors was dubbed in the year 2000. |
The 4Kids dub of Yugioh came out the same year as Cardcaptors yet there's still a lot of fans of that dub even though it was also badly censored. Also at least with Cardcaptors the Japanese version was fully released on physical media and you can even watch it with the Animax dub now and Funimation dubbed Clear Card uncut but Pokemon is still dub only and Americanized and Cardcaptors was only two years after Pokemon. I definitely think it was Kid's WB's weird release order that hurt Cardcaptors the most and it would be a more fondly remembered dub if they had just aired it all in order like Canada did.
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oilers2007
Joined: 23 Sep 2022
Posts: 95
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Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2023 1:53 am
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The theme song was a banger.
I liked the voices too.
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mgree0032
Joined: 27 Jun 2022
Posts: 260
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Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2023 7:40 am
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| Cardcaptor Takato wrote: | | Also at least with Cardcaptors the Japanese version was fully released on physical media and you can even watch it with the Animax dub now and Funimation dubbed Clear Card uncut but Pokemon is still dub only and Americanized and Cardcaptors was only two years after Pokemon. |
Fox Kids did the same thing to Escaflowne back in 2000, when the unedited version was done by the same people who dubbed it.
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Chiibi
Joined: 19 Dec 2011
Posts: 4829
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Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2023 5:40 pm
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| mgree0032 wrote: | | the fact that Fox Kids cut the show into something else and replaced Yoko Konno’s music is very insultingly corporate at worst. |
While that is a valid complaint....almost every anime broadcast for children got its musical score changed entirely 
Pokemon (1997) was the only changed OP I liked better than the original one.
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Snomaster1
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Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2023 5:33 am
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I'll be honest when I say I also liked the "Cardcaptors" theme as well. It had an action oriented and mysterious quality to it that was enjoyable and fit the show well. It's a shame it doesn't get more credit. It's really good once you give it a try.
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